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Spark Plug = HP ?!?

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7.9K views 16 replies 9 participants last post by  vision_nut  
#1 ·
I used to run a small engine shop and became a great believer in quality spark plugs. NGK plugs have always had copper cores loooong before Champion "came out" with them. In my ultralight airplane with a 2 cycle engine, platinum plugs way outperform regular plugs. When a piece of equipment came in for service, first thing we did was throw away the Champion plug(s) and install NGK. I came across this web page selling a plug I've never heard of: http://www.magnumtuning.com/en/detail/performance-bike-spark-plug I wonder if any of you have had experience with it, and if you've found a favorite plug for the Victory engine. OR....do you run a high voltage ignition with a hotter spark.
 
#3 ·

Guys seem to like the NGK's. Spark plug threads are like oil threads you will get 1000 answers.
The bottom line is your ignition system is only as good as the weakest link. If you change the coils, like the MSD ones we used to sell then whats the next weak spot? Wires, plugs? You bump up the amps or voltage and the rest of the system can only take so much. If your stock ignition system is burning all the gas that you can dump into it you will not gain performance. Now if you add more fuel / air / compression etc, you then need to ignite (burn) that extra fuel which will create more power. You will eventually find the weak link be it a lean motor- needs more fuel, so maybe bigger injectors etc. Maybe you add so much fuel that you put out the spark. (* that would never happen on a stock or even higher HP Victory. It happens it very high compression engines that run extremely large amounts of fuel such as a supercharged drag car. Thats why Top Fuel cars have 2 magnetos for ignition 2 spark plugs per cylinder.) Once you dump a ton of fuel and air you need to expell the burned mixture via the exhaust valves and exhaust. A free flowing or properly tuned exhaust will make the bike run better because it can "breath" better.
In short, and this is what I tell my customers. NGK plugs work well, If you want to upgrade to our wires then do it because they add a splash of color and look cool not because you will go out and pop wheelies now. If you really want to make added HP do things that improve the efficiency of the engine. Get it dyno tuned for proper efficiency and keep it tuned up. Possibly an air filter, exhaust or fuel controller. You may even see small increases in fuel mileage because its now running correctly. BUT the fuel mileage may decrease because you roll on the throttle harder because it runs so much better! LOL
To get some great guys to work on or Dyno tune you bike check out wwwthevicshop.com and Rylan out in Iowa or check out Kyle of KMC motorsports at some of the bigger Victory events. You can call Kyle at 401-952-7972. He is located in Rhode Island.
 
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#4 ·
Great answer, witchdoctor. Following your logic....there must be some correlation to the Victory lower-rpm engines having a longer time to burn the fuel than the higher-rpm engines....??? Yup, next week my Judge is getting the stage 1 treatment with the Tri-Pros and all. Wheelies?!? On a Judge? I tried! That skinny 140mm tire just does a nice rolling burnout!
 
#5 ·

notaharley said:
Great answer, witchdoctor. Following your logic....there must be some correlation to the Victory lower-rpm engines having a longer time to burn the fuel than the higher-rpm engines....??? Yup, next week my Judge is getting the stage 1 treatment with the Tri-Pros and all. Wheelies?!? On a Judge? I tried! That skinny 140mm tire just does a nice rolling burnout!
I'm not sure about the low RPM question. A longer burn time usually has more to do with connecting rod length or valve lift and duration. If you can slow the piston speed down with a longer connecting rod and keep it at TDC longer you will get more flame travel across the surface of the piston which in turn will burn more fuel thus making more HP. If you raise the valves (increase lift) more you can get more fuel in or exhaust out allowing you to introduce more air fule into the combustion chamber. If you keep the valves open (duration) longer the same applies. They key and speed secrets are how much lift vs how much duration. You can also increase compression to a point which simply means "squeezing" more of the fuel mixture in the given size of the combustion chamber. Again the more you can shove into the combustion chamber, burn and then exhaust the more HP you will get. Superchargers or Turbos really increase the amount of air that can be shoved in by acting like a compressor and shoving it (compressing) it into the cylinder at extremely high pressures. Most guys hear the term 9:1 compression or 10:1 etc etc. When you run a supercharger those numbers can be over 50:1! Thats why when you see Drag cars blow the supercharger off the top of the motor or the funny car body fly off and into the sky its because it blew up and all that compression had to go somewhere.
 
#7 ·

I can't find another plug for my bike, if I could I would switch out the NGKs in a heartbeat. I have much better luck with champs myself. I guess with this bike I don't know yet, but in my cars, my jap motorcycle and my snowmobile, champs run smoother, give me better MPG, idle better, and start easier. So when I find another plug, whether a platinum, iridium, or just plain champ, I will be switching.
 
#9 ·


Notaharley, when I went to the magnumtuning website and looked at the spark plug you mentioned, I immediately Flashed-back to the 1970's when a company called "TORQUEMASTER" was selling plugs that looked very similiar to the ones you were talking about,
So I googled Torquemaster spark plugs just to see if they were still around and sure enough they are, But their website is called
www.extremespark.com check it out they've really got a SUPERIOR plug to offer, I didnt know they were still around because Mauri Lindsey (the Inventor) said to me back then that the torquemaster plugs would'nt work in computerized iginition systems, so I figured they went the way of the the dinosaurs, and were limited to only "OLD-STYLED" iginition systems (points &plugs-magneto-etc), well I guess they found a way to make'm work with modern systems. this much I can tell you from REAL-WORLD experence
I had a 1973 chevy van with a 307c.i. v-8 truck engine w/ a 3 speed manual tranny (3-on the tree), I was a auto shop teachers aide at the time and REALLY into cars, my chevy van was averaging 11 mpg, and that was with a super tune using the "SUN-SCOPE engine dyno set-up at the time, I dont even know if there made any more but it was State-of the-art back then, after reading an article in one of the car mags about the torquemaster plugs, I decided to go to their shop and see if it was "FOR-REAL", after talking with mauri and seeing his DEMO I decided to Try it out, he reshaped the centrificial advance lobes (because the plugs caused a faster burn-so to maximumize combustion) on my distributor and put the plugs in, that was it RESULTS, my van was faster(seat of the pants dyno) BUT my mileage went to averaging14 mpg, I pulled out a couple of plugs after 50,000 miles and there was no carbon any where on the plug, I was sold. one last thing of interest, When mauri DEMO'ED the plugs he did 2 things that were amazing 1-he took one one the torquemaster plugs and dipped it in axel grease so the entire electrode was covered-then he put the plug in one of those old champion spark plug boxes you'de see at auto parts stores where to could press the button and watch the sparkthatyour plugs would make to see what shape they were in, the torquemaster plug burned off all the axel grease, that was pretty cool. Then 2-he took the same plug and dipping it in axel grease again, and put it in a honda 305 scrambler motorcycle (kick-start mind you) and removed the other plug, so only the torquemaster was in the honda, and started kick starting it it fired right up, although it ran rough because it only had one plug in the engine, BTW I dont work for or own stock in his company, like I said earlier, I didnt even know they were still around, their website has some dyno videos that are informative, just my 2cents.
 
#11 ·

I have been a big fan of NGK plugs since I became a "motorhead" back in high school. I put NGK V-Power plugs in everything I owned. Technology has moved forward and I have moved to a new plug. I am convinced that the extra cost for an Iridium plug is well worth the money. They absolutely last longer and they provide a more direct spark in my opinion. I have been happy with them.


I know its a HD but I couldn't find any similiar video with a Victory.
 
#12 ·

victoryismine said:
I have been a big fan of NGK plugs since I became a "motorhead" back in high school. I put NGK V-Power plugs in everything I owned. Technology has moved forward and I have moved to a new plug. I am convinced that the extra cost for an Iridium plug is well worth the money. They absolutely last longer and they provide a more direct spark in my opinion. I have been happy with them.


I know its a HD but I couldn't find any similiar video with a Victory.
Someone I know, because of that video, did a 3 run average with standard NGK plugs and a 3 run average with iridium plugs...HP and torque were too close to call (within .2). Theiridiums were then gapped wider (.045) and no change there either.

The iridium plugs do last longer...

I'm running 11:1 compression and all that. Stock ignition with Witchdoctor/Taylor8mm plug wires (black). I have spoken at length to several engine builders and they all said the only gains from coils/wires/fancy plugs is they look kinda trick and the wires are better insulated.
 
#15 ·

I have checked with a few different parts stores, none of them can come up with a cross for the stock NGK plugs, anyone have a cross reference plug for these bikes? Its a 2012 XC, DCPR6E is the stock plug.
 
#16 ·
I'm so glad I am not in the business anymore! Your experience is a perfect example of what's happened to America. Hire bottom of the barrel for short money to hopefully make a bigger profit. Screw the guys who actually have experience. The plug you need is a Champion RA8GHC. I can't believe they couldn't do that. Sad.