[hdstn]

Erik started using the Rotax in the HD days in the 1125. HD allowed him the motor when they axed Buell since it wasn't theirs and wanted nothing to do with it. Erik developed it further and bought the rights to it from Rotax therefore making it his own which became the 1190 and is still the basis of the current model bikes.

 

[98741]

EBR and Polaris are non starters, Rotax is one stumbling block, Eric's ego is another.

what is the stumbling block with the Rotax its rock solid? Looks like it wold be flexible for several different types of designs.

 

[mjw930]

what is the stumbling block with the Rotax its rock solid? Looks like it wold be flexible for several different types of designs.

The stumbling block is Polaris is an engine manufacturer and Rotax is owned buy its single biggest competitor, Bombardier. EBR only owns the rights to this one block and still has to source components from Bombardier.

If Polaris wants to build a sport bike they have all the talent they need. While Eric is a bit of a cult figure he really hasn't done anything that a good engineer with the right tools can't do with far less baggage.

 

[robsvision]

The stumbling block is Polaris is an engine manufacturer and Rotax is owned buy its single biggest competitor, Bombardier. EBR only owns the rights to this one block and still has to source components from Bombardier.

If Polaris wants to build a sport bike they have all the talent they need. While Eric is a bit of a cult figure he really hasn't done anything that a good engineer with the right tools can't do with far less baggage.

There is no stumbling block there. If EBR had been sold to Polaris there would be NO ROTAX parts used in any design by EBR. That's not a stumbling block, that's business. EBR was auctioned off. Out of business. The process of buying EBR would have brought a new design talent and a new product line. As in sport bikes that EBR wants to build under the direction of Polaris.
A VTwin sport bike with EBRs touches (185HP) is exactly what the Victory line needs.

Well I guess I will continue to be the shiit disturber.
If what you say is true. And taking into account Polaris deep pockets and so called talent.........
Where is the product? I Been asking this for YEARS. Oh wait it's in the other devision. The Indian division.

I am going to stick my neck out here. I read that Polaris went out of house to build the 111. They needed help from out side sources.
Now I can't find proof or even the original article.
And it may have been your typical internet BS

If that article was BS
Then what's up in there bike devision?
Is there two completely different departments? Indian/Victory
Two completely different engineering groups/ departments?
Completely different talent resources?

There has to be more info here. Something internal to Polaris bike division is still very lop sided.

 

[robsvision]

I never paid much attention to Erik Buell
But after reading this I am impressed
Buell Motorcycle Company - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[mjw930]

I'm not sure why some seem to think a sport bike is something Polaris will ever build. They would have to be out of their minds to consider getting onto the super sport arena, they would have their lunch handed to them almost immediately.

I personally doubt they will ever try to enter the naked standard space either, the market is simply too small and the competition is simply too good. For example, the KTM Super Duke is arguably one of the best bikes in this space and I don't think they can sell 1000 of them in the US annually. Why would Polaris waste any time or money on a bike in this space with such meager returns?

EBR is boutique at best, destined for another liquidation at worst. 2 decades of attempts have lead to a small, cult like following but nothing more. I wish them luck but it's simply not a bike hundreds of thousands of people are standing in line to buy.

 

[robsvision]

I'm not sure why some seem to think a sport bike is something Polaris will ever build. They would have to be out of their minds to consider getting onto the super sport arena, they would have their lunch handed to them almost immediately.

I personally doubt they will ever try to enter the naked standard space either, the market is simply too small and the competition is simply too good. For example, the KTM Super Duke is arguably one of the best bikes in this space and I don't think they can sell 1000 of them in the US annually. Why would Polaris waste any time or money on a bike in this space with such meager returns?

EBR is boutique at best, destined for another liquidation at worst. 2 decades of attempts have lead to a small, cult like following but nothing more. I wish them luck but it's simply not a bike hundreds of thousands of people are standing in line to buy.

They don't have to compete with the likes of the KTM.. (Not that they could)
It's about offering a wider line.
And I don't mean a line of look a likes
The demographics are changing. As Harley will die a slow death if they don't offer something more than a old mans cruiser. So will Polaris 2 lines.
victory needs a Spory type of bike for the younger crowd of riders. And the Octane is a good start for a beginner bike.
They need to develop bikes that carry the younger crowd into the type of bikes they have now.
There was a thread done on the VOG , it said how old are you.....
We are a bunch of elders. Very few young owners.
That's not a good sign.........

Cruises
Braggers
Touring
Some type of sport touring with most emphasis on SPORT AND POWER..
Maybe a dual purpose like the Honda Affrica.
Even a Dirt bike would be cool.
Victory needs to ether stand separate and tall against Indian or give it up...

 

[mjw930]

I don't necessarily disagree and I think the next Vision may be on the sportier side and sport water cooling making it a much more desirable alternative to Goldwings and BMW's.

The 1200cc platform has a number of directions it can go and I think over the next few years we will see what PI has up their sleeves. I certainly expect an Octane S with a better suspension and about 20 more HP in the 2018 MY timeframe as well as the new Vision but I feel it's unlikely they will dip their toe into adventure bikes or standards in the foreseeable future.

I believe a lineup like that would bring in the more of the 35 and up crowd which is the sweet spot for disposable income. I don't think they should waste their time chasing 20 somethings, they just don't have the money a premium bike commands.

 

[Steele11b]

Over/under = 24 months.

Under.

 

[robsvision]

I don't necessarily disagree and I think the next Vision may be on the sportier side and sport water cooling making it a much more desirable alternative to Goldwings and BMW's.

The 1200cc platform has a number of directions it can go and I think over the next few years we will see what PI has up their sleeves. I certainly expect an Octane S with a better suspension and about 20 more HP in the 2018 MY timeframe as well as the new Vision but I feel it's unlikely they will dip their toe into adventure bikes or standards in the foreseeable future.

I believe a lineup like that would bring in the more of the 35 and up crowd which is the sweet spot for disposable income. I don't think they should waste their time chasing 20 somethings, they just don't have the money a premium bike commands.

That sounds good
I can only hope they are working on the Vision. This is very important to me.
The Vision showed the world that there was a new kid on the block that wasn't going to fallow the cookie cutter crap that was already on the market.

Octane S
Good idea but will not be anything new. It would take very little effort on there part to bring that to market.

So now we need some bikes for that 35 year old buyers!

 

[jellybean764]

I have an 01 Cyclone and I love it.I also have an 09 Ulysses that I haven't ridden yet but I can't wait to get it out.Buells are a lot of fun.