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Discussion Starter #1
Ok I'm hosting the next Cub Scout(Wolves 2nd graders) meeting and our topic is learning about the flag. Well it's easy to find information about how to fold, how to display, how to dispose of properly.

What I want to do rather than just reading to them the real details, I want to know what the flag means to you. When you see one displayed, one raised, you sing the national anthem before a ball game, etc. what do you feel, what does it mean to you and why?

What reaction does the stars and stripes bring out of you?

Thanks in advance to the contributors.
 

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Being PGR I've seen a lot of flag draped caskets in the last 4 years or so. When I see a flag anywhere now I'm reminded that a lot of good men and women have given their lives to keep it flying.
This won't mean squat to a second grader, but it will someday....
 

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I'll admit, seeing the flag doesn't mean much to me at first glance. But then I almost invariably think about it for a second, and I start to recall the history behind it, and the people who designed and built this country as well as those who defended it. I feel the pride of what was accomplished by my ancestors, and asmaller pride in my own contributions.
I remember that it's our responsibility to teach that pride to our kids- or be prepared to see our country fail.
 

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It reminds me of the blood of all that have fallen to give us the rights and freedoms we all share today. I hope the next generation learns all the sacrifices the previous generations have gone through to keep the flag flying high...
 

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Amen Don !

It reminds me that freedom is anything but free. And when i see people in Uniform, they get my respect and thanks for all they have done and continue to do.
 

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Interesting. How many of us were protesters back in the 70s? Do you remember believing any of the stories that came out of Nam, and the stigma attached to the guys that came home?
Do you still believe those things?
 

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In 1970 i was 11 years old and the only thing i knew about Viet Nam was the few things i would see on the news at night. After growing up and learning more Im ashamed at the way this country treated our returning service men .
 

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Discussion Starter #9
in the 70's i was in the single digits so no protesting there for me, but I have to admit how I'm a little surprised at how few responses this thread has gotten.
 

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redpin04 said:
in the 70's i was in the single digits so no protesting there for me, but I have to admit how I'm a little surprised at how few responses this thread has gotten.
** Warning "SOAP BOX TIME" **​
I was to young to remember most of the war but my father served in Korea then Vietman and have heard a few stories growing up. But I never heard much about protestors, he left Vietnam in late 1975, by then I believe most of the protest were over with but I was only 5 or 6 in 75. After I graduated from college I felt it was my duty to join the service and did so during wartime. Just my chance to give something back to the Country that gave me so much.
I was shocked also by the limited amount of comments. I expected allot more from a website community that stands behind an American made motorcyle. I have gotten my fair share of crap about being a Suzuki guy and told "well you should support American products." It's funny the guys that have given me the most grief are silent on this issue. I didn't realize patriotism stopped at what motorcyclewe ride. Our flag is the most important patriotic symbols we have and I really thought there would be more opinions.
** END OF SOAP BOX **​
Hey Red, another reason for the lack of comments might have been the thread title?
 

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Well, I'm from the city of Baltimore and am familar with the "Star Spangled Banner" and the story of the Battle of Baltimore during the war of 1812 - you know, the bombardment of Ft. McHenry that inspired our National Anthem. I made it a habit of taking my kids to Ft. McHenry when they were growing up and having them see the fort, canons and all that is there. To the Smithosionan in DC also to see the actual burnt, scared flag that flew those days of the attack. I'm always amazed at the lack of knowledge by most peopleof that place and its place in our history. We have a 15 star/15 striped flag that the park rangers at Ft. Mchenry graciouslyraised for us on the flag mast at the fort one time and we fly it whenever we can on special days. Most folks around here (Chicagoland area)think we got a cheap imitation flag that wasn't made properly. My dad was a WWII Vet, part of the 29th Division that entered the war at Omaha beach. Whenever we went to an Orioles or Colts game when I was a kid he'd shed a tear when the Anthem was played. Growing up I never knew why - but I do now, and appreciate it. Whenever I hear the Anthem I also shed a tear in honer of his rememberance - and shout "O" for Orioles in my best Baltimore tradition, haha.
Nick
 

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Ya, I know, I tend to get off topic too much. But this does kinda relate to the website, or at least to those of us who frequent the website.
I was fresh out of high school in '73- the year the draft was dumped. My draft number as I approached graduation pretty much guaranteed that I'd be seeing the world. I was just hopeful that world didn't include southeast Asia. A few of my slightly olderneighbors came back completely screwed up, a few came back in a box. I graduated, the draft was cancelled, and so ended the possibility of my military service.
I never considered them anything but young men sent off tofight the old mens' battles. I wanted the US out of Nam, much like I think we have no moral reason to be in Iraq and Afghanistan. Regardless, I respect those who went- to every war staged by our politicians.
We're no longer fighting for freedom, in my mind. That ended with WW2, when a sucker punch pulled us into a conflict, much like the latest cowardly sucker punch has generated this conflict. I'm not buying the line anymore thatour thousands of troops arehunting the terrorists who attacked us (that could probably have been accomplished with a couple hundred SEALs/Rangers/etc.); there never were any WMDs in Iraq, and we're not freeing a country of tyranny. They don't WANT to be free, and we're ignoring that message in favor of keeping and maintaining an American controlling influence in an oil-rich region.
Bikers, in my mind, are independent thinkers- as I've noted in other posts. Victory riders are even more independent than most, riding a new brand that isn't readily accepted in the biker community. As noted above, we made the choice to buy and back an American made bike, most of us for purely patriotic reasons. By that line of thinking, Victory owners tend to be thinking independent patriots, less likely to follow than to lead.
So in my independent patrioticbiker thoughts, I still believe in this country and the values the flag represents. I believe we have made many mistakes over the last 40 or 50years and we have allowed our government to decay to something worse than useless- but there exist a silent majority of Americans who know things are wrong and will eventually wake up to fix the problems. I'm ready for it.
(will someone please burn that soapbox, so I'm not tempted anymore??)
 

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Dimonback said:
Ya, I know, I tend to get off topic too much. But this does kinda relate to the website, or at least to those of us who frequent the website.
Well, to keep it short. I may not agree with your politics (just because I dont know where you stand) but I can't argue with your thoughts. There has been a turn in thinking in America but it seems like the minority is becoming a little less silent. I am one of the minority and have been everything but silent in my feelings on what our problems as a Nation are. It should be mandatory that every student has a working knowledge of the Declaration of Independance and the Constitution before we ammended the crap out of it. Unfortunetely there are truly only two ways to straighten out the government, one would be the establishment of an equally powerful third party ( I proudly support the Libertarian Party) the other way I will not mention on a motorcycle blog...
Let me leave you with this quote and I would like you all to think about where we are at as a whole...
"A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves money from the public treasure. From that moment on the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most money from the public treasury, with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world's great civilizations has been two hundred years. These nations have progressed through the following sequence: from bondage to spiritual faith, from spiritual faith to great courage, from courage to liberty, from liberty to abundance, from abundance to selfishness, from selfishness to complacency from complacency to apathy, from apathy to dependency, from dependency back to bondage"
 

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This needs bumped. Let it not be said all we think about is motorcycles.
And Don's last quote is something that needs to be read.
 

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redpin04 said:
What I want to do rather than just reading to them the real details, I want to know what the flag means to you. When you see one displayed, one raised, you sing the national anthem before a ball game, etc. what do you feel, what does it mean to you and why?
One Word: Freedom.

Why: Because we won't know what we've got until it's gone.
 

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I love the colors of the US flag - and what they represent. I think of it all the time. The meaning of the colors can be traced back to the Code of Chivalry when honor and integrity meant something.

Red: The color of Courage, Valor, Enthusiasm, Blood & Life.
Blue: It represents the sky. That we should lift our eyes upward and respect God. It also stands for Truth, Strength, and Loyalty.
White: Purity, Sincerity and Peace.

An odd note - originally both a star & a stripe was added with each new state. This was stopped w/ 15 stripes. A resolution was passed reducing the stripes to 13 to honor the original 13 colonies (1818). Since then - a star only was added to represent a new state.

To me - I reflect on the incredible sacrifice that has occurred through our history & is continuing to this day. Not all wars were popular. The original American Revolution was supported by only 50% and sometimes less. The Civil War was very unpopular at times.

But through it all - when I look at the flag I think of commitment - even when you're not in the mood. I think of sacrifice for something bigger than you. I think of teamwork - caring about the guy next to you, sleeping in your foxhole, sloshing though the gunk with you, sharing his canteen and sharing his last "John Wayne" bar.

Old Glory reminds me we have to move outside of ourselves and be committed to things that are good and not always easy. The flag reminds me of brave men and women that gave everything because they believed in things that might be - but only hoped they would happen - with no guarantee. I love the National Anthem and the story of Francis Scott Key when he wrote it - and the key role the flag played. Most of all - Old Glory reminds me it's important to do what's right - to stand for something - even against all odds. Even when it's not popular - but in your heart you know it's right.
 

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Being retired military and seeing the flag raised and lowered hundreds of times it still chokes me up when I see it blowing gently in the wind. I am proud to say that this flag and its heritage tugs at my heart strings whenever I see it.

I am reminded of the dirt bag [email protected]# holes that have burned this flag in the name of free speech that my Grandpa, Dad, Father-in-law, Brother-in-law, Uncles, myself and many friends have defended. I say they do not have the right to burn the flag and need to be banished from the United States forever. More so this action disrespects those who have honored it faithfully by paying the correct respects when it is lowered, raised or is flying while the national anthem is played.
 

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To me the flag represents the freedom to live the way I want and go where I want. It honors all that have given there all for the freedoms and rights that we enjoy.
I may not always agree with our government leaders at al times so I use the right to vote to change things.
My brother came home from Vietnam and when he landed in
Washington St.
he was met by protesters. It upset him so much he wanted to take his purple heart and go back.
I was rejected from the service because of bad eyes. But I honor each and every one that is and have defended this contrary and flag.
When I raise it up on the pole every morning I solute you.
Joe
 

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Even more off topic, but applicable to the thread:

An Obituary printed in the London Times
Today we mourn the passing of a beloved old friend, Common Sense, who has been with us for many years.
No one knows for sure how old he was, since his birth records were long ago lost in bureaucratic red tape.

He will be remembered as having cultivated such valuable lessons as:
Knowing when to come in out of the rain;
Why the early bird gets the worm;
Life isn't always fair;
and maybe it was my fault.

Common Sense lived by simple, sound financial policies (don't spend more than you can earn) and reliable strategies (adults, not children, are in charge).

His health began to deteriorate rapidly when well-intentioned but
overbearing regulations were set in place:
Reports of a 6-year-old boy charged with sexual harassment for kissing a classmate;
teens suspended from school for using mouthwash after lunch;
and a teacher fired for reprimanding an unruly student, only worsened his condition.

Common Sense lost ground when parents attacked teachers for doing the job that they themselves had failed to do in disciplining their unruly children.

It declined even further when schools we re required to get parental
consent to administer sunscreen or an Aspirin to a student; but could
not inform parents when a student became pregnant and wanted to have an abortion.

Common Sense lost the will to live as the churches became businesses; and criminals received better treatment than their victims.

Common Sense took a beating when you couldn't defend yourself from a burglar in your own home and the burglar could sue you for assault..

Common Sense finally gave up the will to live, after a woman failed to realize that a steaming cup of coffee was hot.
She spilled a little in her lap, and was promptly awarded a huge settlement.

Common Sense was preceded in death
by his parents, Truth and Trust;
by his wife, Discretion;
by his daughter, Responsibility and
by his son, Reason.

He is survived by his 4 stepbrothers:
I Know My Rights
I Want It Now
Someone Else Is To Blame
I ama Victim

Not many attended his funeral because so few realized he was gone.

If you still remember him, pass this on.

If not,
join the majority and do nothing.
[TBODY] [/TBODY]
 
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