The cure for EV range anxiety | Page 9 | Victory Motorcycles: Motorcycle Forums

The cure for EV range anxiety

Discussion in 'Victory General Discussion' started by 1stVictory, Apr 2, 2021.

  1. BP6666VR

    BP6666VR Well-Known Member

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    This is a VEEY good video about Tesla 2021 & 2022 fabrication improvement procedure, love this

     
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  2. BP6666VR

    BP6666VR Well-Known Member

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    Oh oh .... How to put out a EV fire,

     
  3. iabob

    iabob Well-Known Member

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    I wouldn’t mind the electric busses we have here burning, they suck. I don’t know anything about those Chinese busses, the ones we have are from an American company named Proterra. The drive line is pretty nice, but they ride for crap. I mean total crap. I’d really like to see one on a lift in the shop just to see if there actually is anything resembling a suspension on these things. I was really looking forward to a quieter bus, but all the banging, rattling, and squeaking over the slightest road imperfections make these things actually much louder on the inside than the diesels we get from New Flyer, which I think are Canadien.
    On the subject of fires, yeah fire is scary. We had a diesel bus catch fire like that a few years ago just as the driver was pulling on the lot. Thankfully not while passengers were on board. Fire extinguishers were no match for the blaze. I think of them as a tool to get out and away, a little 10 lb can isn’t going to put out 80 gallons of diesel or 400 lbs of Li batteries.
     
  4. BP6666VR

    BP6666VR Well-Known Member

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    This was posted by @Joe on the other Vic forum and thought it was interesting

    On green electric vehicles and their role in saving the planet..

    Our analysis suggests a modern lithium-ion battery has approximately 135,000 miles of range before it degrades to the point of becoming unusable. An extended-range Tesla Model 3 has an 82 kWh battery and consumes approximately 29 kWh per 100 miles. Assuming each charge cycle has a ~95% round-trip efficiency and a battery can achieve 500 cycles before starting to degrade, we conclude a Model 3 can drive 134,310 miles before dramatically losing range.

    Incidentally, Tesla’s Model 3 warranty covers the battery for the lesser of eight years or 120,000 miles and does not apply until the battery has degraded by at least 30%. If the Jefferies analysis is correct (and we believe it is), then an EV will reach carbon-emission parity with an internal-combustion vehicle just as its battery requires replacement. This will come as a huge disappointment for those believing that EV adoption will have significant impacts on CO2 reduction.

    https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/i...carbon-footprint-evs-may-offer-negligible-co2

    Not to mention their lackluster performance in snow at low temperatures.

    https://carbuzz.com/cars/tesla.../2020-tesla-model-3-long-range
     
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  5. iabob

    iabob Well-Known Member

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    The author of this post makes the same false assumptions as many other critics, mostly that the popularity of EV’s is to “save the planet”. Unfortunately the origins of this analysis also includes false information leading me to question if it’s indeed analysis at all, or just a bias attempt at persuasion masquerading as analysis. A couple of examples: the model 3 uses approximately 21 KWh per 100 miles, not 29 (an almost 30% exaggeration), and has a life cycle of about 1500 cycles, not 500 (greater than 30% exaggeration). The author is manipulating, or outright falsifying information, to make it look like environmental costs are greater and benefits are lessened. Apparently in the belief that a guy like me will be swayed towards buying something of his choosing instead of my own choice. If he actually understood the true motivations behind my choices and not just made assumptions he might understand the folly of his exercise...

    As for performance in cold temps, this is true but not in the way it’s portrayed. The loss in range comes from electricity being used to heat the interior, not because electricity doesn’t flow when it’s cold. So if it matters, the owner leaves the car plugged in overnight, and uses his cell phone to turn the climate controls on when he’s getting ready for work. Now when he unplugs and leaves the garage, the car is already 72 degrees and the battery is still at 100%. Keeping it warm takes less energy than getting it warm. But more importantly for most people, it doesn’t matter. If my total potential range is 350 miles under ideal circumstances and I lose 20% when I’m using the heater non stop, I’m down to 270 miles of range. For the sake of argument say it much worse than that. Double the loss and say I’m down to 200 miles of range. So what? I go to work, I run errands, I come home. Even if I use 50 miles a day, no big deal the battery will be back at 100% tomorrow morning.
     
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  6. iabob

    iabob Well-Known Member

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    This might explain the motivation of the source behind the false information, which is the politically correct term for “lies”:
    Zero Hedge - Wikipedia
     
  7. BP6666VR

    BP6666VR Well-Known Member

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    Now that is a serious good write-up i like it very much and absolutely agree with you, thank you for putting so much effort into this ..
     
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  8. BP6666VR

    BP6666VR Well-Known Member

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    Why EV motorcycles fail



    Good video ...
     
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  9. iabob

    iabob Well-Known Member

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    It is well done and hits on an important point. Don’t try and make a machine be something it isn’t good at. We don’t abandoned diesel because it sucks at sports car application, we build around it’s strengths not it’s weakness. Same for electric, makes sense for some applications, not others. My guess is motorcycles will stay gas at least until a commercially viable solid state battery is available for a competitive price.
     
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  10. T0ng5

    T0ng5 Active Member

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    I'm all for technology and advancement, and I think the Tesla's are really cool, but I personally don't think that there will be a large market for electric motorcycles anytime soon. Too many people love the sound their bike makes. While that sounds like dumb reason, how many people keep the stock exhaust in their 106 lmao?
     
  11. iabob

    iabob Well-Known Member

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    Well no poser does that’s for sure! Lol, neither do us performance junkies. And while I’ve ridden electric motorcycles and they’re amazingly fun, yes absolutely, the limitations of current battery tech is just insufficient for big motorcycles. Scooters and bicycles are and will sell by the ship load, but there just isn’t enough room for enough battery to make a big motorcycle viable, and if you found a way to add more battery it gets too heavy quick. So cars yes, scooters and bikes yes, motorcycles no.

    On a side note, something I’m looking forward to a lot...electric lawn mowers. When I get the opportunity I love to take a mid afternoon nap in a hammock on the deck enjoying a summer breeze. And in my suburban development I can hear at least three neighbors mowing their lawns regardless of when I want to nap. I will really enjoy it when the sounds of small Briggs and Strattons are not drowning out the sounds of nature.
     
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  12. BP6666VR

    BP6666VR Well-Known Member

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    1/4 mile production car record

     
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  13. iabob

    iabob Well-Known Member

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    You know what’s crazy is I was a full testosterone teen male in the 80’s. If you guys are around my age you remember how opec and insurance double teamed to kill the muscle car in the 70’s. But by the late 80’s, manufactures were getting back on the performance wagon. I can remember for years the Porsche 911 Turbo held the 0-60 crown at like 6-1/2 seconds, and regular-guy fast cars like Mustang 5.0’s and Camaro Z28’s were trying to beat 8 seconds. 4 seconds for a family sedan-suv and 2 seconds for a flagship model is CRAZY. Even at 130k for the flagship...like Jay said, that level of performance elsewhere is seven figures. Insane.
     
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  14. T0ng5

    T0ng5 Active Member

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    Tech right now is pretty insufficient for just about anything, you can't go on long hauls with them and you couldn't run a sports bike for a full track day. Now some of those naked bikes, they look promising, but they don't do anything exceptionally well, they're not great for long hauls, they're not the fastest, and they don't handle the off-road the best, they're right in the middle of just about everything and I think that's where the EV bikes will shine. Something you can run to maybe the city over, go have a good time at the track (or the nearest twisty), commute, whatever.

    I think that all the EV people are pushing it too hard and I think all the gas and oil guys are resisting it too hard lmao. I think with natural progression eventually yeah, most vehicles will be electric. I definitely agree with what Jay Leno said in that video, it's the next progression of transportation.

    See I'm the opposite, I have always associated a mower with the sounds of a great Sunday morning. You got the smell of coffee, some Chihuahua going crazy, kids yelling and screaming, the mower, the birds.... To me at least, that's the suburban Sunday morning I like.

    I hate to pop your bubble, but every guy I've heard that owns either a battery or a 120 volt electric mower hates them lol. Maybe in a few years...
     
  15. T0ng5

    T0ng5 Active Member

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    Now all they need to do is match the damn speed limits to the car's performance, at this point there's no reason I can't push 95 on the interstate legally :fiddy:
     

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