Scott Wine Resigns | Page 7 | Victory Motorcycles: Motorcycle Forums

Scott Wine Resigns

Discussion in 'Victory General Discussion' started by Rollin, Nov 17, 2020.

  1. Flyboy

    Flyboy Well-Known Member

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    Yes the sister-list, an always evolving wishlist based on what is tickling the fancy. Not the prime love, but will fill in or for the moments of madness for something different or an overnight stand...
     
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  2. Ghostrider25

    Ghostrider25 Lone Rider of the Apocolypse

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    Yes, something for which to commit guilty pleasures with...

    [​IMG]

    And this isn't even my top 5 dream bike list!
     
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  3. Flyboy

    Flyboy Well-Known Member

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    Yeah that captures the emotion quite well, one of yours?
     
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  4. Ghostrider25

    Ghostrider25 Lone Rider of the Apocolypse

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    @Flyboy No Sir, just a great image I stumbled across!
     
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  5. Rujimbob

    Rujimbob New Member

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    So.... now they’ll announce they’re going to stop making Case/New Holland, but assure customers they will keep parts coming for ten years. Then stop making parts literally that same year?

    Sounds legit..
     
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  6. CRC-VKP

    CRC-VKP Active Member

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    Well crap time to sell my tractor! lol NOT (it's an 05 TC33DA..does everything it needs to..!)
    As couple folks mentioned, wonder how big was this a-hole's "Golden Parachute" was here to leave?? Nothing like go in...crap a company...rake in the dough to 'move along'.......repeat..
     
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  7. John G

    John G Active Member

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    Well here’s my two cents worth: Wine didn’t listen and didn’t want to put money into marketing Victory, or supporting it, even before the purchase of the Indian Marque. They bought Indian and gave it all the support, marketing, engineering, product support etc that Victory should have had. They simply saw it as an opportunity to make more money. Maybe, also to make improvements they were too arrogant to make with Victory? Who knows?

    All CEO’s have a pet project that gets done whether it makes economic sense or whether it shutters another product. Wine was no different.

    Whatever the reasons, personal, ego, or economic, we will never know for sure. I briefly thought about taking an Indian test ride a month or so ago, and then decided that I did not trust Polaris enough to plunk down money with the possibility of getting screwed over again. It just ain’t happening. A new CEO could easily dump Indian, or motorcycles altogether. I would love to see the financials on Indian. I wonder how I could get hold of them?

    I’d love to see the Victory line renewed and resurrected, but I think it’s a pipe dream. No incoming CEO is going to do that, even if it makes economic sense. It’s just not done. It’s a matter of silent support. Plus to do that would make the entire Board of Directors admit that they screwed up. Not happening folks.

    I love my Vic. I doubt I’ll ever sell her. But, who knows?

    Cheers
     
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  8. Chattanooga_Mark

    Chattanooga_Mark Well-Known Member

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    Just a hunch, but I suspect the Slingshot line will be killed off in 2021. Polaris Industries is a lot of things. One thing they are not, is a 'motorcycle' company.
     
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  9. Known1

    Known1 Well-Known Member

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    Polaris is a public company. With that said, they don't really break out the various segments of their business with a whole lot of detail. To this day, we still don't know exactly how many Victory motorcycles were produced.

    The closest thing you're going to get can be found here: Polaris Inc. - Investors - Financial Information
     
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  10. John G

    John G Active Member

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    Thanks Known1. I was going to see if I could download the Polaris financials and see how they handle the Indian brand. I tend to agree with Chattanooga_mark that the slingshot might go away. I have no info to back this supposition up, just a gut feeling. To me, it looks like a fun thing to ride in for about 5 mins, but it’s certainly not worth the money in my opinion.

    I don’t know how sales are doing.
     
  11. iabob

    iabob Well-Known Member

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    In 2017-2018 I followed the financials pretty closely. As a stock owner I had followed them for years before that, but as a pissed off rider emotionally invested in Victory I followed them with the interest in seeing just exactly what the result of the “business decision” was. As you read through the stock holders presentation what you will find them report is total revenue and gross profit by division, but then later they give operating cost as a % company wide. Gross should be sales minus cost of goods, net would be minus operating expense, what did it cost to run the factory. So this is usually reported as about 17-19%. So to do the math I looked at gross profits by division, then subtracted the 17-19% (whichever number was given in that report) from the revenue and that gives a net profit by division. But that net is an estimate. Cost of operation isn’t equal across divisions. Big divisions (Rangers and UTV) spread costs among more units sold so their cost of operation would be lower, small divisions like motorcycles would be higher, and averaged together we get the 17-19%. The result was divisions like 4 wheelers and snowmobiles made a lot of money. When you subtract the cost of operations from the gross profit there was still a lot of money left over, net profit. When you apply the same math to motorcycles...not so good. Cost of operations ate up all the gross profit, little to no net left over. And that’s being generous by applying the average cost of operations, not the actual.

    The thing that would concern me about this if I was an Indian fan is we know Wine was motivated to make his “business decisions” look good. A new CEO quite posssibly could look at these statements and conclude that for every dollar he reinvests in 4 wheelers and snowmobiles he gets a higher return on investment than he would if he put the same dollars into motorcycles. So why would he put any dollars into motorcycles?
     
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  12. John G

    John G Active Member

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    Here’s the motorcycle info from the 2019 10k report.


    “ Motorcycles:
    Sales of Motorcycles, inclusive of PG&A sales, increased seven percent to $584.1 million for 2019 compared to 2018. The increase in 2019 sales was primarily due to increased sales of Indian motorcycles of 14 percent, partially offset by a decrease in sales of Slingshot of approximately 22 percent. The Company estimates North American industry retail sales, 900cc and above cruiser, touring, and standard market segments (including Slingshot), decreased mid-single digits percent in 2019 compared to 2018. Over the same period, Polaris North American unit retail sales to consumers decreased approximately 10 percent. North American Polaris motorcycle dealer inventory increased mid-teens percent in 2019 versus 2018 levels. Sales of motorcycles to customers outside of North America increased approximately 24 percent in 2019 compared to 2018, due primarily to an increase in Indian motorcycle shipments. The average per unit sales price for the Motorcycles segment in 2019 was approximately flat compared to 2018’s per unit sales price.“

    you can see that the slingshot isn’t doing well. Motorcycle and slingshot are 9% of company income.
     
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  13. Bikesofbrads

    Bikesofbrads Well-Known Member

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    They had hoped Indians name recognition alone would create the sales numbers closer to what HD does because after 17 years the Victory name did not. Sadly is just business 101, Polaris motorcycles are all going to be the same breed no matter what names on the tank. A names just a name, it’s soul is given by the maker & is why the “new Indian is our old beloved Victory’s
     
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  14. Known1

    Known1 Well-Known Member

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    Those are very wise words as far as I'm concerned. With that said, Indian Motorcycles is a household name no matter who is making them. I suspect that's why Polaris bought the name and killed Victory. Everyone that knows anything has heard of Indian Motorcycles...Victory not so much.
     
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  15. Sharps

    Sharps Active Member

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    I always liked the design style of Victory. And to me liked the idea it's not a Harley and different. I was still torn between a Breakout and a Vegas. Fortunately, sales guy at the Harley dealership was a dick, and I spent half the money I was going to spend on the Harley and bought my Vegas. Couldn't be happier, used the rest of the money to make it my own.
     
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