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Politics 2.0

408429 Views 17918 Replies 64 Participants Last post by  Flyboy
It was asked that we have a fresh start on politics and I thought it was a great idea. To start though I want to reiterate the goal is to remain free of name calling and personal attacks. I know we can do it.

So I will again say,

I want to be able to discuss anything and everything and have never felt the VOG should be just motorcycles. We are a motorcycle community sure, and being such we are a family with a common interest.... But not that sole interest. With that I do not believe we should only be allowed to talk bikes. Goodness, half our active members are about to park their bikes. What do they talk about? Bike covers? Boring!

So some of these other interests will be other shared like minded things and some not. I think we should be able to discuss whatever we want as a family no matter if we agree or disagree in a civilized manner.

Remember nobody is forced to participate or view threads they don't like. If you don't like a topic do not venture into the middle of it.

So with that if y'all want to continue in that way I need EVERYONE'S help.

  • Stop the name calling.
  • Stop being rude.
  • No more references to sex acts with oneself or others.

I don't mean jokes and sarcasm. Not even dark humor. It's the mean name calling and overall rude behavior that we need to stop. No more personal attacks. That would make a huge difference and if we can do it give nobody a reason to shut anything down in the future.

I don't mind putting in the work here as I was here anyway, but it's certainly added to my plate. I'm happy to though because I enjoy this place. I think we can accomplish this but those that can't will be warned, then given a temporary ban, with a temporary or indefinite ban to follow.
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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Doesn't bother me either way. I don't like mandates but if it was presented to me I'd accept it and not whine like a three year old. I'd either take the shot or look for other employment. Personally, I think the vaccine is better than nothing and will continue to get even better so I take it. I dont tell others if they should or shouldn't take it unless they ask my opinion. Then I tell them I would and why.
It may be better than nothing but not everyone has nothing. Like me. I've had covid twice. Plus I have my youth.

I would agree that you should get the vaccine. You are in more than one high risk category so it makes sense. That's not said to be mean. It's just the truth. Just like my aunt. She got it and I said "good." No fuss from me and I didn't get any from her.

But even though I don't have nothing you still think I should get the shot or loose my job. It just makes no sense.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Mandates hopefully are coming from duly elected politicians that use health professionals advice and the will of the majority of their constituents. Whomever dosen't like it always has the opotion of trying to become the majority and change their representatives. The majority of our population support the vaccine and mandates if necessary.

Majority in U.S. Supports Biden COVID-19 Vaccine Mandates
Really? Did they ask you? They didn't ask me. Who did they ask? Where did they ask?

Polls can tell whatever part of the truth you desire with the right polling pool being used.

What if the government mandates people be healthy and charge those with high BMIs? It's a health issue that would prevent hospitalization for many like I've seen mentioned so many times for people with covid. So why not? It's for your health? How bout if you have a high BMI you are forced to eat only salad until you are a healthy weight? When are we going to mandate a ban on smoking?

People being overweight and smoking is hurting them much more than I ever will not being vaxed.

I don't see how you can be for one part of health for the greater good and not be for health in everything.
 
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Discussion Starter · #31 ·
For those jumping up and down over having to get THE vaccine. If you are reading this, live in the USA, you've had several required/mandatory shots.

YOU SURVIVED ALL OF THEM.

Just get the damn shot and move on. Rest assured there will be something else to fight over after this coms down.

Heaven forbib we actually be one united under God !
You survive everything you go through until you don't. Do you know which event will be the one that takes you out? I certainly don't. I've had many near misses over the years and over that time I became more and more cautious because of each. They taught me to slow down at times and don't get sucked into a situation. That is all I'm doing. I'm slowing down and doing what I believe is best for my wife and I. Maybe one day I'll get it. Probably will be around the time I start getting the flu shot.
 

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Discussion Starter · #32 · (Edited)
You have a valid argument if all you care about is yourself.
It's not about who I care about. It's about who I'm responsible for. That's my wife and I. Nobody else.

People have been living their lives the way they want smoking, drinking, and overeating for many years putting them in high risk categories for a number of things.

BUT NOW, it's my responsibility to do something for their health? What sense does that make? Where were they last night when my wife and I were in the gym until almost 2am, after both putting in a full day of work? Did they improve their fitness in some way yesterday.... Will they today? I doubt it. They probably just continued their glutenous lifestyle thinking not even about themselves.

Maybe I could start to care about their health and wellbeing when they do. Typical behavior though is put yourself in a bad spot and expect someone to save you. I'm not like that. I'm extremely self sufficient. In my career I've been the savior many times. This however is not one of those times I should be.

Tell you what if you give me the legal right to slap cheeseburgers out of fat people's hands I'll get the shot.

All the things you mentioned will only effect the health of an individual.
Using the same argument I've seen with covid.

When the time comes and a overweight diabetic goes to the hospital because they have over eaten making them morbidly obese and then not properly cared for their diabetes they should be turned away just like people want those with covid that haven't been vaccinated to be?

Is it not the same?
 
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Discussion Starter · #34 ·
Spoken like a true public servant! No reason to reply with another broken record response. I get it.
I don't know who told you public servants need to be robots and do everything they're told but that's not true. We're regular people with regular lives outside our job. We have family, hobbies, interests just like anyone else. We shall have our own belief systems.

With all of that we get to make our own decisions just like you do. We have rights too. Do we never get to be regular people?

The guy flipping burgers doesn't need a shot in your eyes and you're not worried about that, but you're worried about me having it. Why are public servants on a separate list?

Why do you not care about my wife? Why do you want me to risk losing her? I've said several times the women in her family have heart issues and that her mom died 30 days after getting the second shot. During that 30 days she was having chest pains and had a doctors appointment the morning we found her dead to get it looked at. She didn't make it in and ultimately died of a heart attack.

So you want her to get the shot to "save a few", but don't mind her dieing from it because of things outside of our control?

That's a tough way to get me to start caring. I live for my wife and would die for my wife. She's my number one.
 

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Discussion Starter · #36 ·
Does she have a job that is mandating it? Im sure with a valid doctor's excuse the requirements would be lifted.
Thankfully she doesn't.... At the moment. If this 100 person company mandate goes into effect? Then she would....I think. They would be close if not there now. Certainly no room to grow.

Again, I don't care if you get the shot or not. It's just a personal chice which has possible consequences.
Maybe if it effected your life you would feel differently. If it comes down to us both losing our jobs that is what it will be. I'm good with that and we'll survive. It just shouldn't come to that.
 
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Discussion Starter · #37 ·
I was told a story yesterday from a guy that participates in CrossFit. They had a guy there that competed in CrossFit as well as power lifting. He was described as a picture of health.

He got the shot and almost immediately had an adverse reaction to it. He ended up dieing from it.

Just like people don't know how they'll react to covid you can not be certain how you will react to the shot. I've had covid, twice, so I have more knowledge than some to decide what is right for me.

I'm certainly not signing up for a shot that I know nothing about to combat what I've already had and have an idea of my reaction with. I'm simply going with the known instead of venturing into the unknown. I've said before maybe I would get the shot if I hadn't had covid. Then I'd have two unknowns. That's just not my reality.
 
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Discussion Starter · #46 ·
I am not the only broken record. You kinda have to be though when the other side of the conversation is as well though.

I just find it ironic that I am supposed to care about people's health when others do not care about mine. What happens when I get the shot and die? It is not like I can say "I told you so." I will be dead and nobody but my family will care.

I am not wanting anybody to be forced to get or not get a shot. That is a person's personal choice they need to make. Just because they choose to get it though does not mean they now should have any say in whether or not I do. This is all part of that one way street the country has been on for many years now.
 
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Discussion Starter · #56 ·
And you are offended about a vaccine?
How bout the girls body and the girls choice?
No I'm not offended people want a vaccine or even that they want me to. I'm just not into them trying to force it. Either by mandate or restrictions like entry to businesses.

You can get them all if you want. Collect them all. I read earlier that with both boosters you'll have up to six months of "protection."

Switching to abortion. Is six weeks the proper amount of time? I'm not sure but I think it's going in the right direction. I'm certainly not for terminations in the ninth month of pregnancy like I've seen some suggest being acceptable. Who was that one guy that said on radio just after the baby was born it could still be terminated? Yeah, that's murder.

Having a child is not supposed to cause harm or death, it brings the opposite.... But if the girl is in danger from the pregnancy I am all for her choice to abort. Was that stipulation not in they new law? I'm pretty sure it's in there.

Now if she misses the six week limit and had the baby nobody is making her keep it. But if I get the shot and have bad reactions I can't give them back or away because I don't want them.
 

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Discussion Starter · #57 ·
That didn't take long, the Staff members favorite friend name calling.
I think you and I both know you're reaching on that.

But,

Please report things you believe should not be allowed. I'm trying to look at everything but I'm sure I'll miss things at times. Let's have some common sense about it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #70 ·
But you are in favor of forcing a rape victim to carry the rapist's seed full term as the law is today in Texas if she passes 6 weeks.
Not really. Maybe we should ask those that have been through it. I would go with whatever their consensus was.

Phycological trauma, leading to suicide, depression, child abuse, later.
Yes, but the same can happen with getting the abortion. Neither choice must be easy. Expect the child abuse of course.

No, the law forgot to put that in.
I knew the rape/fam rape wasn't in there. Getting one because of a medical need is though. That's was I was referring to.
 

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Discussion Starter · #71 ·
I don't think I have a right to say what a woman does with her baby. Granted I should have some say if I were the father. I personally think there should be a time limit on when you can have an abortion unless the mother risks losing her life at any time during the pregnancy.

By the way abortions and a mandated vaccines are on two different playing fields.

A woman chose to have sex, which can get her knocked up (the government didn't tell her to have sex). Yes, some don't and that's not right but rape is another playing field all together. One shoe doesn't fit all when it comes to abortions.

Vaccines shouldn't be mandated period. Especially ones that aren't proven and have more risk than reward.
True. Have any of y'all met a child of rape? I have. Do you think they wish they were aborted?

There are many things to think about when it comes to rape and I agree it's not very well compared to a forced vaccine.
 

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Discussion Starter · #78 ·
I'm against abortion because of my religious beliefs. Jeremiah 1:5 "Before I formed you in the womb I knew you"

I'd hate to stand before judgement denying that I read that. Whatever route you take in judgement is your route, but not mine. I will not judge. That's for God. Ok bible is put away for now. :)
I am with you but I know I can not hold others to my same values and beliefs. So with that they can not hold me to theirs. In that though everybody has to work together for something that can be agreed upon as a whole. So if that is six weeks or eight? I don't know. But I know it shouldn't nine months or the five minutes after birth. I really can not see how anybody could even think of that let alone agree to it.
 
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Discussion Starter · #80 ·
Never have met a rape child. However, I think someone that was raped should have the choice either way. I'm sure the decision would still be hard on the female.
Has to be the hardest decision she'll ever have to make. I think going either way there is emotional damage.
 

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Discussion Starter · #89 ·
Extra mile?

Interesting. :think:

So after we give we need to give even more.

While we give, others give nothing. Then those others want us to give more.

I guess enough is never enough for some.
 

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Discussion Starter · #131 ·
The Covid shot does not prevent you from getting Covid. It also does not prevent you from spreading Covid. It is supposed to lessen your symptoms. With that being said. What if it lowers enough to where you don't know you're sick? Now you're spreading the virus just like an unvaccinated person that is asymptomatic.
I have that same thought. The time I got tested I barely knew I had it. I only got tested because the wife did and was positive. If she didn't I doubt I would have noticed and would have probably been going through life as I normally do.

My only real symptom was a loss in smell for a few days. I would have thought I would notice not having smell but I really didn't. After I got the positive test I recalled that two nights before I was laying in bed watching TV and my bulldog was BLOWING it up. I remember thinking, "wow, those don't smell." Didn't think anymore about it and went to sleep. Turns out I had covid and the loss of smell was a good thing that night.
 

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Discussion Starter · #137 ·
People's health is not my responsibility. That is not the job I signed up for. Taking a bullet and taking a shot is very different. I am not a doctor, nurse, paramedic, or even a health inspector.

I don't look to others to protect me so why should they look to me to protect them.....when it comes to medical issues. Again this goes back to not just covid but all matters of health in life. People kill themselves a little each day with the way they simply live but now it is everyone else's responsibility to keep them healthy. So am I to start taking fat people's burger and fries? Slapping cigarettes out of people's mouth? Again, that is not my job. Those people have the freedom to do as they please and so should I.

If you want to wear a mask and gloves go for it. I don't care. The majority of the people doing it though do it incorrectly and constantly cross contaminate things. My favorite so far was a lady reading a community in a lobby with her mask on. As she goes to turn the page she pulls down her mask and licks her finger to turn the page. She did this a few times. Just one of many I have seen.

The truth is the vaccine doesn't actually work to prevent covid. It merely....maybe....might....reduce symptoms.....do nothing......or give you major complications.....even death.
 
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Discussion Starter · #138 ·
I do have to say I gave it to my fiance, because she lives with me.
My wife gave it to me. We knew she had it but I was not about to ask her to stay away from me. I slept with her all cuddled up like usual.
 
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