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I'm wondering

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I'm finding it quite strange that the 2023 Indian models have yet to be announced.

Starting to get flashbacks from January of 2017 and their announcement of the death of the Victory. Even in that year, July, they announced their 2017 lineup with the one new addition of the Victory Octane.

By now all the big manufacturers have released their 2023 lineup and information. Well except for Polaris.

They've released their offroad lineup already.

Not even a peep about the motorcycles.

North America unit retail sales for Indian Motorcycle were down low-forties percent. North America unit retail sales for the comparable motorcycle industry were down mid-twenties percent.

So the market was down 20% but Polaris doubles the drop. That makes me think a lot. All the big manufacturers struggled with supply, why did Indian drop twice as much?

For 2021:
North American consumer retail sales for Indian Motorcycles decreased low-double digits percent during the fourth quarter of 2021 in a mid-to-heavy-weight two-wheel motorcycle industry that was up mid-single digits percent. North American consumer retail sales for Polaris' motorcycle segment, including both Indian Motorcycle and Slingshot, increased low-single digits percent during the fourth quarter of 2021. North American consumer retail sales for the motorcycle industry including both two-wheel and three-wheel increased low-single digits percent during the fourth quarter of 2021. Indian market share loss was driven by a lack of product availability during the quarter driven by supply chain challenges.

Their off road division was down 359 bps, on road down 71 pts.

The only division that was up was their marine.

Since motorcycles/slingshots are such a small part of their overall business and sales have been mostly flat the last few years as well as supply issues. It's highly probable that they're a money losing division as well.

Their sales have been down the last few quarters. They sold off GEM and Taylor Dunn.

Could they be preparing to pull the plug?
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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Well supposedly they saw a boost in sales when they went to the 'harley-esque' look.
That being said, sales have been down across the board since i think second quarter of 2021.

It's hard to say how much they attribute to supply chain and how much has dropped due to market changes.

Not being a motorcycle company makes you wonder if they thought the initial surge of Indian sales over Victory was a roadmap of things to come. So they decided to pull the plug on Victory and follow Indian to only see the initial strong sales then a slow decline into where they are now.

Some of the local dealers stock hasn't changed all year. Mostly scouts but a few Chiefs and 2 dealers both have had Pursuits, non darkhorse, non premiums for several months.
One of them announced last week they had a darkhorse premium that a customer pulled out of and they sold it within a day.

Really not sure, starting to feel a bit like 2017 again.
 

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Discussion Starter · #21 ·
Love the ftr carbon. My only gripe is the price. I can buy a ninja 1000 sx for 14k with adjustable windscreen, heated grips, and seat along with bags. Money is tight. People are going to look for the best bang for the buck.
the dealer I bought my Pursuit has this model on their floor. Never been my style for bikes but it did grab my attention. I have no idea how well their Scouts and their derivatives sell.
I can say that this bike is the 3rd most expensive new vehicle I've ever bought.
I think motorcycling in general may simply price themselves out of the market.

The days of cheap bikes as a alternative commuter vehicle are way behind us.
My biggest grip with motorcycles is the relatively short life span of the tires vs the high cost of purchasing and having them installed.
 
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Discussion Starter · #29 ·
Indian is in good shape financially. Polaris is worth 5.86 billion with 1.42 billion in debt.
You're looking at Polaris as whole, not Indian. Indian only exists because Polaris has the money to toss around.

Harley HAS to make bikes, it's all they do.

Being such a small percentage of their annual sales for Polaris company wide it won't take much for them to pull the plug.

They're not a motorcycle company, they're a profit driven company, they bought Brammo, gone, they had a watercraft company they shuttered in early 2000. They bought TAP and liquidated that after a few years of losses.

Their money is 95% coming from their off road divisions.

Excerpt from Polaris Second Quarter 2022 Earnings Results | Polaris

North America unit retail sales for Indian Motorcycle were down low-forties percent. North America unit retail
sales for the comparable motorcycle industry were down mid-twenties percent.

If its not turning them a tidy profit they're not going to keep making them. It's not their bread and butter, hell it's not even the end crust of the bread.
 
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