I have cookies thanks to the Darkside
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look for the dark side videos [video]2339[/video]
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hmmm, is that a real concern of yours or is it just wishful thinking? BTW, i have 40,000 miles in her saddle, with all but the first 7,000, as a darksider. i ride the old girl hard: car tire rocks! to me, there is absolutely no reason to go back to a motorcycle tire. besides, i love cookies. last year i bought a new Honda Sabre to ride to work and take some miles off of the Vic. as soon as it needs a back tire, it will go darkside. riding season is here, in full, so i am hoping to go the year without having to read one "rider down" post.
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Piss Pot, Good to see you back and to hear you're still piling on the miles! Even better to hear that you still find time to work with all that riding. It does my heart good to know that there's another ex-Ammo brother that still can't sit home and do nothing after many years playing the part of a workaholic! Umby
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I ran a car tie on my Triumph Rocket III for years and loved it. I could corner at around town or highway speed and it felt natural. Once the edges wear down, the cornering become instinctive. Only real downside was brakingon wet roads. The rear tire would lock and slide on wet roads. I figure this was due to not enough weight to keep the tire gripping the road surface. Damn tire would throw one hell of a roster tail in the rain!
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Michelin Primacy Alpin PA3 ZP GRN is a Snow-tire.foambuilder said:
You chose it because of the softer compound?
Run-flats are usually noisier too.
I sure wish there was a video of a Motorcycle Tire done the same way as the Car Tire Video was done... just so that I can see the difference in the contact patch.
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158 Posts
Thanks for posting this thread Piss Pot.
I've been Dark Side on my Nomad for 14K+. To me the only reason for running a motorcycle tire on the back is, "It came with a new bike I bought". I run a 205/60-16 Goodyear Triple Tread (all season).
Difference in a CT tracking is more about contact than shape. A 205 CT has about the same road contact (straight up) as a 300 MT. The same 205 CT has about the same contact as a 160 MT cornering (to the boards). The more contact patch you have, the more your motorcycle tends to follow grooves (side tracking). That's why they put skinny tires on dirt bikes . . . less tracking. I don't want a lot of side tracking in corners anyway so that's a + in my book. Some riders notice the difference in counter steer pressure more than others, but it's about the same as getting used to a new bike. No 2 models ride the same.
Apply Geometry principles. Most of a motorcycle's need for "sticky traction" is under either heavy braking or heavy acceleration. > What is the best "lean angle" for heavy braking or heavy acceleration? < At what "lean angle" does a CT provide the greatest road patch?
How the brakes and acceleration work is up to the rider. I ran the same roads to and from work for months before and after going Dark Side. My "speed to the boards" in some of my favorite turns increased by 5+ mph with the CT. Heavy breaking is much more stable and stopping distance is about 20% shorter than with a MT. Acceleration is about 20% quicker, and I don't "smoke" the tire doing it.
Apply financial principles. Average CT including mounting is about 1/2 the price of a MT but lasts 2-3 times as long. Want to know why some tire companies and motorcycle shops object to Dark Siding? Check the bottom line. $$$
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There a rider by the name of Rollin who left his house in green bay on a brimstone run flat went down to the Florida keys and up to the Alaskan hwy and never had a problem.
I have the same tire and have read where guys are getting about 25 thousand out of them. Thats a shame cheating dealer out of his $225 dollar tire. I only paid $115 out the door and with over 10 thousand miles on it still looks like new. Yes 40 psi I check my tires once a month and front we
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Usually, the heavier bikes are touring bikes ( but not always). So heavy bikes like a Honda Goldwing, Kaw Nomad, Vision, XC, or XCT are heavy and may travel alot on the slab or freeways. I think my twisty stuff has to be around 10% of my total miles (2011 XC/14K miles).El_Dave said:
In addition, a motorcycle is using one of the smallest car tire sizes out there, they don't get much smaller than 175/60-16, 195/55-16 and so on. It becomes a question of "will it fit?". Some car tires of the same size still vary in width and height with the same size numbers.
Another thought to consider is wet weather traction is much improved with a car tire, especially the all-season kinds, or softer snow-type treads. My Michelin Primacy Alpin PA3 ZP (run flat) 195/55-16 throws out a heck of a lot of water in the rain. Some other bikers won't ride behind me in the rain because of this water dispersion deal. For me, I like the wet grip. Fortunately, it even works better in some snow - which happens at odd times in the mountains.
My Michelin doesn't care about tar snakes. The original Dunlop E3s are terrified of tar snakes. Works for me.
If you are going on a long trip, say 5-6000 miles, it is a pain to take off a perfectly pretty-good tire to make it all the way through the trip. Of equal annoyance would be having to get another tire somewhere out on the trip. Add mileage and Run-Flat safety are pluses for the darkside in my book.
The darkside is not for all bikes or even all riders of heavy bikes. You make your own choices and go from there.
YMMV
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I just checked the OD & tread deapth on my 205/60-16 Goodyear Triple Tread. I have had this tire on for 17K miles and it still has 6/32" (about 1/2 of the usable tread). Granted, I'm a little easy on tires. My OEM "Stone" went over 11K and still had "barely legal" tread when I replaced it.
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I'm stickin' with the 175/60/16 for my XC. I love that it does not have that stand up feeling. I'm currently using a
Dunlop snow tire which has a softer, more grippy, tread which is fine by me. I'll probably get around 25k miles out of it and will look for another one if I can find one. There are phasing out that particular tire for some reason I have no understanding of. Well, maybe I do, since I just looked for what I've been using in that size they don't have that one anymore but they do have a new and improved version so I guess I'm good to go in a few years when I'm ready to buy one.
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Dunlop&tireModel=Graspic+DS-3&partnum=76QR6DS3&vehicleSearch=false&fromCompare1=yes
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I'd just like to say that even though I really like the way the darkside tire feels on the bike and the double mileage or more with them; it's the safety factor I get with the run flat tires because most of my long distance riding is alone in the desert and many times it is over 115 degrees so a dependable bike with a dependable tire is a huge plus.
I also double darkside with a Bridgestone rear M/C tire on the front which so far has done great. Rides and handles as good as or better than any front tirre I've had on any bike in the past so I'm sticking with what works and will put another one of those on sometime after turning 20 somethink k miles with it too in a few years.
I have 4 bikes right now so it takes me a while to get the miles on any one of 'em.
http://www.motorcycle-superstore.com/1/28/396/6013/ITEM/Bridgestone-Battlax-BT-45-Sport-Touring-Rear-Tire.aspx
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FWIW- The Honda GL1800/Goldwing riders have been using this "double-dark" combination for a while. It works for them and those guys put on some miles that would take 5-7 Vic's to do. Go to:BBob said:
http://gl1800riders.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?31-Darkside-Riders
For more info and reviews, etc - gl1800iders dot com.
My Dunflop in the front is still fine, but it will go away sooner or later.
YMMV
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So when you call TireRack, what kind of Car do you guys say you have?
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I ordered most of mine from tire rack online ( 4 on the goldwing and one for the XCT ) and did not say what car it fits , but if you have to call them the mini cooper uses the same size tire. just do a quick search for mini cooper to know what year and model takes the tire your ordering.
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just installed my 2nd Hankook Venus V4 ES 195/55 VR-16. i purchased it, again, from tirerack for $89.00 ($103.00 to my door). the last one netted me 20,000 miles running at 39 psi. this tire, for me, is perfect for the CC and the way i ride. matter of fact, i am goung to have to replace my running boards pretty soon and the D&Ds will have a hole ground through them shortly. love this tire.
the run flat Kumho i first installed, lasted just 10,000 miles: i wore the center out of it. being that it was a run flat, the side walls are really stiff. to get it to handled the way i liked, i played with the tire pressure until i settled on 44 psi. it handled good, but it didn't last long. i decided against mounting another run flat again. the second tire, i think it was a Bridgestone, ran best at 41 psi. again, i wore the center out at about 10,000 miles. did not like that tire, never felt right, especially in the rain. then i ordered the Hankook, viola. my CC will only ride on that tire from now on.
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