Dynojet Power Vision CX | Page 12 | Victory Motorcycles: Motorcycle Forums

Dynojet Power Vision CX

Discussion in 'Tech Q&A' started by mayday78, May 22, 2017.

  1. Chuckz71

    Chuckz71 Member

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    I've never been to a dyno session, but I have wideband road tuned tuned my truck (with assistance from a remote tuner) after I bored and stroked it. I would think that wideband road tuning would be more effective to get a better tune for non-wide open throttle and transition conditions (especially if done by an expert such as Noemntz) than a dyno session, but a dyno session might provide opportunity for greatest power tune (under WOT). But again, I'm ignorant to what a dyno session does other than WOT pulls for numbers.
     
  2. waterhog

    waterhog Well-Known Member

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    With your experience wideband street tuning your truck, you should be able to DIY tune your bike. PVCX or Maximus, it shouldn't matter much. If it doesn't work out, you can always go to a pro, dyno or remote. Yes, the features available in PVCX are more advanced compared to Maximus, but they aren't essential to get a decently running bike. The real-time display in PVCX is nice but you can pick one or more not-too-busy ~20 minute routes, let PVCX generate logs, and do the tuning offline. In my case, due to safety and declining eye sight I chose not to actively utilize real-time readouts. By doing repeated runs over the same stretch of road, you'll know how to interpret the logs.

    As to dyno tuning, putting your bike on a dynometer is the only way to properly tune a bike. Everything else is an approximation. In some cases, the approximation is good enough, in other cases not.

    The VE table captures the innate breathing property of an engine with specific intake/exhaust. It can only be accurately identified in a controlled, repeatable environment where load is varied to sufficiently sample all relevant cells accurately. When street tuning you'll get spikes and other discontinuities which are due to the environment being non-stationary and noisy. Physics dictates that VE tables must be smooth. So a bumpy VE table from street tuning has be smoothed, intrapolated and extrapolated to improve driveability. Experienced tuners will know what to do and when to stop so that their customers are likely to be content.

    Then there is timing calibration where most of the bike's torque (hence HP) comes from. Without risking pinging, this can only be safely done, especially for our Vics that don't have detonation sensors with adaptive retardation, on a dyno under controlled conditions. Experienced tuners will know what timing tables will approximately yield good performance for such and such configuration. On a dyno, timing advancement can be optimized safely to get the most torque out of the bike. In remote tuning you are likely to leave some torque off the table since tuners cannot risk being liable for engine damage.

    And then there is idle tuning, decel pop mitigation, etc. where a dyno can help but is not as beneficial. Anyhow, you probably know the above but just in case.
     
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  3. Chuckz71

    Chuckz71 Member

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    I still consider myself a novice tuner. You mention a lot of good stuff, and some great points on differences and advantages of a dyno.
    You also mention the one thing that seriously concerns me about DIY tuning... Vics lack of knock sensor to assist with timing adjustments.
     
  4. TwoManyXS1Bs

    TwoManyXS1Bs Well-Known Member

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    Get 'em while you can.
    Things are disappearing...
     
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  5. Chuckz71

    Chuckz71 Member

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    Truer statement here than I wish. I thought I found the last DynoJet PV CX for sale anywhere at Vicidracing.com and bought it near end of May. Did screenshot like I normally do of purchase confirmation. Never received email from them with confirmation. Call couple weeks later to inquire, was told they had sent an email for “off-road use only” waiver, which I didn’t receive so asked them to resend. I only got auto generated emails when I did their online inquiry, to which I fully filled out with all data and replied. Had to call every week and only ended up being on hold and leaving voicemail except 2 times. I only wanted confirmation they actually had one. After a month.. they didn’t, and ended up refunding me. So I bought a TechnoResearch Maximus from Witch Doctors and got that yesterday (quick shipping!). I’m gonna buy a wide band for the Maximus too after a few weeks of playing. The Maximus packaging as well as TechnoResearch’s online site have zero info on connecting and initial how-to. I’m sure I’ll figure it out once I take the unit out of the fabric box. DynoJet and their software, which I had previously downloaded on my pc to look it over, seems like a much more user friendly system. Oh well. I’m the Maximus train now... I’ll reconnect my O2’s tomorrow, and hook it up and start playing with it. First goal is to get the decel pop out. Then order Lloyd’s air filter later.
     
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  6. IndyVictory

    IndyVictory Well-Known Member

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    Have fun with your tuning.

    Bit annoyed that I bought my used Vic and the PVCX in 2018 only for DJ to suddenly drop support.
    Oh well it still works.

    Sad part is with a software update the newer version would probably work fine with our bikes. Connector didn't change.
     
  7. Chuckz71

    Chuckz71 Member

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    DJ told me they still supported PV CX when I emailed them, meaning if I had issues they would help me out, a couple months ago. As long as the PVCX works I don’t see any reason to be disappointed in your decision. I’d actually be happy to have gotten it when available. But then again I knew there may not be a replacement CX unit available if I was able to get a CX. It seems that neither the CX or Maximus have great tune repositories available for the DIY’ers like other tuners. (I was able to find that DJ does have a few available on their site)
    I wonder if this site has the ability to host tune files and would support such? There are so few that DIY with tuners that I would hope those that provide such services wouldn’t mind.
     
  8. slickvic

    slickvic Well-Known Member

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    No need to worry. A licensed tune from Noemntz is all you need. The best part is the support you get. The tune you get and it’s done. There are others also that will perform remote tuning. I’m sure Maximus has a list of qualified tuners to visit and some with Dynos.
    Jupiter Cycle Florida and Conquest Customs in Boca come to mind. Then there’s our own beloved Kevin X in High Springs Florida. He nor longer has his shop but caN perform service at his own shop at home by appt only.
    North Carolina ..... well there’s Lloyd Greer. The man himself who now owns in partnership an Indian dealership that also performs Victory work. Look around. There’s still good people out there.
     
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  9. IndyVictory

    IndyVictory Well-Known Member

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    Yes, they do provide unlimited support for what they sell.
    As for tune sharing that is easy with PVCX.
    Still each tune would need tweaked to the bike but I have tunes from my bike, another bike, and dynojet tune which is worthless.
    You can still buy a PVCX but stock is limited.

    I just think they should have extended supporting Victory with the newer PV3. Same connection as Indian. Wouldn't be difficult for them to do it.
     
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  10. Chuckz71

    Chuckz71 Member

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    Where can you buy a PV CX at? I've looked for the past couple of months, and would have paid more (I did with my first two orders of PVCX, both of which were refunded due to no actual stock). So I settled on Maximus. C'est la vie... Maximus should still be a capable ECM flashing product, just not as convenient as the PV CX.

    I do need to correct my statement above about "TechnoResearch’s online site have zero info on connecting and initial how-to". I had forgotten I had previously found TechnoResearches "manual" before. They do not make this easily findable.
    For Direct Link (tuning software): http://technoresearch.info/manuals/directlink_help_files/Introduction.html
    For Centurion (diagnostic software): https://technoresearch.info/manuals/centurion_help_files/Introduction.html

    I also need to correct my statement about waiting on the Maximus Wide Band. In my tiredness, I forgot the Maximus supposedly needs the wide band to data log... (another benefit of a PV CX).

    I'm making notes of my work in a doc, and intend to start a thread of my TechnoResearch Maximus experience later.
     
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  11. IndyVictory

    IndyVictory Well-Known Member

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    Maximus is really unknown for DIY work.
    At least the PVCX is somewhat documented thanks to Craig Bennett blog posts.
     
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  12. waterhog

    waterhog Well-Known Member

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    It would be informative if you would follow up on that. I had hoped that data logging can be done on Maximus so that narrowband tuning is an option.
     
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  13. wickman

    wickman Active Member

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    Thats the beauty of he Maximus , get tune done and forget all about it, no extra hardware to ever worry about malfunctioning, just ride and enjoy.
     
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  14. IndyVictory

    IndyVictory Well-Known Member

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    That is the same with PVCX so I'm not sure what you are trying to say. I love not having something extra attached to bike. :)
     
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  15. wickman

    wickman Active Member

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    Just goes to show my non knowledge of pvcx , I thought it was like a power commander, I’ll just slowly back out of the conversation.:biggrin:
     
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