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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I know people who work in law enforcement are under a lot of strain at times but there is no way a simple traffic stop should have ended like this. The guy was polite and there was no reason for a gun to be pulled. Even the Chief agrees that the detective was in the wrong. Watch the video. It's some crazy crap.

'Very Troubling' Video Shows Detective Holding Gun on Motorcyclist
 

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Went night fishing at a local county park on a lake.
Was down on the dock and saw headlights go thru the parking lot so I walked up to see who was there.
Sheriff's car with door open, officer out & walking toward my vehicle.
I intentionally moved under a street lamp so i would be fully visible.
I called out: "Hello Officer"
He turned & drew his pistol.
I immediately put my hands up & told him I was fishing on the dock & had no weapons.
He made me stand there while he walked up & questioned me.
Finally he allowed me to put my hands down then went into a rant about prostitutes & drug dealers & that the park was closed after dark.
I didn't argue but told him that there were no signs, gates or chains that indicated that & I had night fished there for about 5 years.
He finally settled down & we walked up to make sure there were no signs.
He apologized & asked if I was going to report him.
Told him "No" but I did have his badge number in case it happened again.
He was young & I assume new.
 
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What's the big deal? Obviously that kid has never had a gun pointed at him before. He's just lucky the person holding and pointing the gun is a good guy and on his side.

I agree the firearm wasn't necessarily needed. However, after chasing down some donor riding over 100mph in traffic I would want to ensure the ass hat on the motorcycle doesn't try to tear off when I stepped out of my car to have a word. I can't help but wonder if maybe that's what the detective was thinking as well?
 

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This was post in my Cop Corner in there either land. This was some of my responses after it was stated the officer may go to prison.


I don't think much will come of that. The bike not recording his mentioned reckless driving is a big sign that he knew he was wrong in riding the way he was. Reckless driving sounds like an appropriate charge if the guy was in fact doing what the officer said.

As for the gun. Well, the officer is a detective with no vest and no other weapons. This leaves his sidearm. Now depending on his department policy he may have been within it. What cues the officer saw is unknown. Merely drawing and pointing a gun at a person was never documented until recently and it is still not done by smaller departments. I've pulled my gun on a ton of people without ever having to report it. Unless a gun is fired it was not recorded.....until fairly recently.

The detectives demand for the ID is also fairly common with sport bikes. Many if not most who are riding crazy run from the police, in my experience. It is fun to them and if they are a good rider it is fairly easy to quickly evade a car. The detective being in a plain car allowed him to sneak behind the biker and make the stop at the light. The light turned green though which gave the bike every chance to ride off and evade. The officers language may get him dinged but his demand for the ID is not a problem. The officer has an unknown person with a covered face sitting on a speed machine known to evade police. If you can figure out who you're talking to straight or the gate it makes finding them later much easier.

He was aggressive but without knowing his reasons I really can't say if it was warranted. I can just go off what we do see and from what I've experienced. I do think the officer should have identified himself better.


A part of a second response.


Having a gun drawn is really the officers decision on what they think of the situation. There are not any will, shall, or shoulds when it comes to drawing down on a person as it's hard to outline police encounters.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
There was no reason for a gun to have been drawn .It was a simple traffic stop. As the sheriff stated the guy was nice and polite. I have been stopped for worse and the Georgia State Trooper had a good laugh and did not even write me a ticket. He asked me why were you doing over 120 mph and when I told him I was in a hurry to get a hair cut he started laughing and then we started talking bikes and pretty soon we parted ways. No fuking gun was involved. I do not care how many times you watch the video there is nothing that justifies pulling a gun. As the sheriff says speeding is a misdemeanor . He was not robbing a store he was speeding. No gun was needed. It's alright to support the guys in blue but everyone makes mistakes and he screwed this one up.
 

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I don't know if I mentioned this or not, but I had a CHP pull a gun on me, too. It was at night and I was speeding. When I got lit up I pulled off at the nearest exit because I didn't want to be out there on the side of the highway at night. So he was mad about that. He asked for my info. I was very polite because I detected an attitude on this guy from the second he got out of the car. So I gave him my license and proof of insurance from my wallet. Of course he snapped at me "Where's your registration"? I told him it was in my hard bag and that I will go get it. When I did he jumped back and drew his fire arm and pointed it at me!

I just froze. I then extended my keys and said to him "Jesus! Here, you can get it!" At that point I think he realized that he was over reacting to the situation, and he was much more calm after that. He holstered his weapon and things went smooth from that point on. I didn't get mad because I kinda understood why he might have done that. It was on a dark, secluded spot and it was at night. And even though I clearly announced my need to go into the pannier to retrieve the registration, I could have reached for anything in there. So I get it, but I gotta tell ya it spooked me. It was all good. We even talked for a while after and parted smiling. But for a minute there things didn't look good!
 

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How about the Dick calling it in so a marked police car could pull him over properly!
 

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Well, I had 8 cops point guns at my car in Illinois around 20 years ago... My license plate light was out.

I have said this before, bigger cops seem to not pull the gun so fast.... Dude on bike running 100mph in traffic and changing lanes, if so, he's gonna run outta time soon.. however none of us know how fast traffic was going, if there's a plate, call it in, turn on lights, dude stops most likely be ok, he runs, well you chase, someone's going to get hurt....

Again, the gun being pulled in the dude on the bike, could have stopped him from taking off, who knows.. I hate when guns are pointed at people simply because some are itchy on the trigger. I've seen a biker get shot in the back for looking over his right shoulder while on his bike... Why was he stopped "he took off to quickly from a stop sign".... Imagine, taking off from a stop sign, get pulled over and shot because you looked over your right shoulder....
 

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I don't know if I mentioned this or not, but I had a CHP pull a gun on me, too. It was at night and I was speeding. When I got lit up I pulled off at the nearest exit because I didn't want to be out there on the side of the highway at night. So he was mad about that. He asked for my info. I was very polite because I detected an attitude on this guy from the second he got out of the car. So I gave him my license and proof of insurance from my wallet. Of course he snapped at me "Where's your registration"? I told him it was in my hard bag and that I will go get it. When I did he jumped back and drew his fire arm and pointed it at me!

I just froze. I then extended my keys and said to him "Jesus! Here, you can get it!" At that point I think he realized that he was over reacting to the situation, and he was much more calm after that. He holstered his weapon and things went smooth from that point on. I didn't get mad because I kinda understood why he might have done that. It was on a dark, secluded spot and it was at night. And even though I clearly announced my need to go into the pannier to retrieve the registration, I could have reached for anything in there. So I get it, but I gotta tell ya it spooked me. It was all good. We even talked for a while after and parted smiling. But for a minute there things didn't look good!
I thought you were going to say he drew on you when you dismounted. Yeah definitely a tough spot that nobody wants to find themselves in. That's on both sides of the coin.

Nowadays if/when pulled over I stop in a reasonable distance, turn off the engine, then the key/lights, and put my hands on the bars and keep them there. The officer then walks up and asks a question or two that I answer without moving my hands from the bars. When they ask for a license and whatnot, I ask if I can dismount as it makes things much easier. The answer is always yes and we're off in a positive direction. Sometimes the officer will cover while I dismount, but if you pay attention next time I"m sure you may notice the same. In any case, show respect get respect and thus far that approach has done well for me; particularly on my bike.

In any situation, if I see cherries in my mirror I'm pulling over. That's just me and certainly helps explain my official speeding record. Worst now unofficial case was in a rental cage from LA to Vegas. That one long story resulted in a weapon drawn and a citation for "105+ mph". It was tough to show respect in that instance, as I was not given the chance and my keys were forfeited immediately. My story to the officer was solid, honest, and fool proof. Ultimately in the end I was scolded, scolded, and scolded some more, given a citation, and then handed back the keys to the rental cage while never exiting the car. I didn't speed again until I hit the NV border...well not nearly as much. As mentioned, it's now an unofficial case that never happened. It was out of state and before 09/11/2001....so keep it under wraps if you don't mind.
 

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I would love to hear this officer articulate a justifiable reason for preparing to use deadly physical force. I give him the benefit of the doubt but nothing in the video I saw would justify drawing his weapon.
 

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Sounds like we have a difference in opinions here. For those of us who actually do the job and not just know someone in law enforcement we can easily see why the detective pulled his weapon. Remember, there is no routine traffic stop. The biker could of just robbed a bank or killed someone. The detective didn't know why he was riding recklessly. We as officers never know what we are walking up on or who we are stopping. We all want to go home after our shift!
 

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Sounds like we have a difference in opinions here. For those of us who actually do the job and not just know someone in law enforcement we can easily see why the detective pulled his weapon. Remember, there is no routine traffic stop. The biker could of just robbed a bank or killed someone. The detective didn't know why he was riding recklessly. We as officers never know what we are walking up on or who we are stopping. We all want to go home after our shift!
I'm not on the job but I've train and trained with members of law enforcement from all over the country. I'm well versed in the laws regarding the justified use of dead physical force. You don't lump all traffic stops together. This was not a felony stop. There has to be some reason which the officer can articulate, explaining why he felt there was a threat to his safety, that justified drawing his weapon, pointing it at another individual and endangering that individual and everyone else around them. Your comment "the biker could of just robbed a bank or killed someone" is your speculation. What we have as "evidence" is what we see in the video and nothing I saw in this video rises to the level that justifies drawing his weapon and pointing it at this individual.
 

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Out of all of the time that I have been pulled over never had a gun pulled on me. I try to make them as comfortable as possible.

Not saying this officer was in the wrong/right, but some could be said about the rider. My concern is why didn't he find a shoulder to pull over on? Why did he keep his helmet on after stopping? That video is missing a lot leading up to the altercation.

Every time I have been stopped on my bike my helmet comes off; now with my modular I just lift up the front. If I have to get anything out of one my saddle bags I'll give the cop the option to go in there.
 

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How about the Dick calling it in so a marked police car could pull him over properly!
Isn't that always the directive? Usually never gets followed.
 

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I didn't watch the video, didn't need to I have seen others like it I'm sure.
I did read all the comments & of course there are different opinions.
I'm not a LEO, I couldn't be, I don't have the self-control needed to do the job.

In today's world with all the crazy $hit going on I'm not sure if law enforcement officer's are hero's or crazy.
Just stop & think about it. It's not just traffic stops, domestic calls or accident sites it's every minute on or off duty.
Who can take that kind of stress?

I'm not justifying an irresponsible act, a cop who displays an incorrect temperament needs to be removed.
But with certain organizations openly calling for killing cops & these organizations not being denounced but actually being praised then you have to ask yourself how would you react?

I'm a long hair & long beard, pony tail down my back & braided beard down my front.
I wear an old brown leather jacket (my avatar) so how do I appear to a LEO?
I think about that every time I get stopped which used to be quite often but I am slowing down a bit.
In all my interactions with the law I can say that there has only been a few incidents of "interest", I posted one in this thread earlier.

So how did those cops access the situation & determine I was not a threat?
And that's the point. The cop has to look at the whole situation & make a determination in a matter of "split" seconds.
His life is on the line with every interaction so I'll give "them" the benefit of the doubt.
 

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What happened to Tasers....seems lately all I've seen/read about, is guns pulled. I'm NOT on bad guys side...trust me BLUE LIVES MATTER!.... AND VIC...thank-you for what you do :clap:...stay dry
 

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I'm not on the job but I've train and trained with members of law enforcement from all over the country. I'm well versed in the laws regarding the justified use of dead physical force. You don't lump all traffic stops together. This was not a felony stop. There has to be some reason which the officer can articulate, explaining why he felt there was a threat to his safety, that justified drawing his weapon, pointing it at another individual and endangering that individual and everyone else around them. Your comment "the biker could of just robbed a bank or killed someone" is your speculation. What we have as "evidence" is what we see in the video and nothing I saw in this video rises to the level that justifies drawing his weapon and pointing it at this individual.
Training is much different than the real thing. In a traffic stop you never know who you're stopping and what they have done or are doing. The chances they have done something wrong when you see an erratic driver does raise the odds they are fleeing from something bad.

Pulling a gun is not dictated by seeing a weapon. If you wait for that you're dead. You have it pulled to be ready as action beats reaction every time. I have never done a traffic stop that my hand was not at least in my gun, usually slightly drawn until after contact is made and I have more information of who I stopped.

You are correct as that was not a felony stop. That was not what the situation called for or possible for that officer.
 
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No such thing.
Please explain what you saw in the video that justifies the officer pulling his weapon and pointing it at this individual. Until you can articulate some reasonable set of circumstances that indicates he was under a threat of bodily injury (not speculation about he was a bank robber) you can't justify what he did.
 
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