Cop Corner 2.0 | Page 26 | Victory Motorcycles: Motorcycle Forums

Cop Corner 2.0

Discussion in 'Off Topic' started by VicVisionBulldog, Aug 31, 2020.

  1. kaitiff

    kaitiff Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2012
    Messages:
    6,805
    Likes Received:
    2,614
    Location:
    Keams Canyon Az
    Type of Motorcycle Currently Riding:
    14 XC/07 KPT
    I totally agree.. actions should have consequences. Shouldn't that apply the other way too? Since the police are given the right to use deadly force, shouldn't they be held to a high standard when they abuse that right? Should the police be obeyed because of respect, or fear? There's only one right answer, and I haven't heard it much on here. Lots of RAH RAH kill the bad guys.. but not a lot of protect and serve. If the bad guys don't think they're going to get a fair shake what do you think they're going to do.. come peacefully or take their chances? The 'flushing turd' mentality only gets you so far, then you have to start watching your back. There's a reason why there are (or used to be) so many 'good faith' missions.. cops going to schools to talk to kids.. sponsoring all kinds of community activities.. when they cops stop being the 'good guys' to the populace and are just jack-booted thugs.. what kind of society does that give you?
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  2. satxron

    satxron Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2009
    Messages:
    10,011
    Likes Received:
    2,095
    Location:
    San Antonio
    Type of Motorcycle Currently Riding:
    2006 Kingpin
    So if he runs you can shoot him?
     
    • Useful Useful x 1
  3. satxron

    satxron Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2009
    Messages:
    10,011
    Likes Received:
    2,095
    Location:
    San Antonio
    Type of Motorcycle Currently Riding:
    2006 Kingpin
    Is resisting or evading arrest a Felony? Is not allowing yourself to be handcuffed a felony if you are simply stronger than the officer? Is running away from a misdemeanor a felony?

    The answer to all of those in Texas is "No". Resisting is a Class A Misdemeanor. The Supreme Court has commented on at least three cases now that the Officer must weigh the serious nature of the original crime, community safety for the conduct at hand and officer safety before using lethal force. There is a Police Officer in S. Carolina right now that got 20 years for shooting a runner in the back.

    In an imperfect world there are no perfect answers. But we have seen the police make the best choices most of the time. It all has to be looked at. There is no absolute.
     
    • Informative Informative x 2
    • Like Like x 1
  4. satxron

    satxron Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2009
    Messages:
    10,011
    Likes Received:
    2,095
    Location:
    San Antonio
    Type of Motorcycle Currently Riding:
    2006 Kingpin
    He shot him in the back, he was allowed with the knife, no complaint at all.
    And then he shot him in the back.
    And then he shot him in the back.
    And then he shot him in the back.
    And then he shot him in the back.
    And then he shot him in the back.
    And then he shot him in the back.

    Tedious huh? Well, 7 shots in the back is, I dunno, I say a lot.

    At any time do you think the guy was not a danger? Like when his spinal cord was severed or when his lung was blown up?

    I want to know how much fight he had in him after the first shot? But, I agree with your professional opinion that the officer panicked.

    It appears to be a tactical screw up from beginning to end. But the shooting I think was clearly legal. How he got all the way around his car is mindboggling.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
  5. VicVisionBulldog

    VicVisionBulldog VOG Police Chief

    Top Poster Of Month

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2011
    Messages:
    19,158
    Likes Received:
    8,657
    Location:
    Houston
    Type of Motorcycle Currently Riding:
    13' Vision Tour / 08' Vision Street Premium
    I'm only responding because you gave me the perfect opportunity to show how little you know.

    Evading on foot is a Misdemeanor unless you have a previous conviction at which time it is a FELONY.

    Evading in a motor vehicle is a FELONY.

    Resisting is a Misdemeanor unless the officer is injured because then the charge will often be changed to Assault on a Police Officer which is a FELONY.


    Sec. 38.04. EVADING ARREST OR DETENTION. (a) A person commits an offense if he intentionally flees from a person he knows is a peace officer or federal special investigator attempting lawfully to arrest or detain him.



    Text of subsection as amended by Acts 2011, 82nd Leg., R.S., Ch. 839 (H.B. 3423), Sec. 4, and Ch. 391, Sec. 1




    (b) An offense under this section is a Class A misdemeanor, except that the offense is:

    (1) a state jail felony if:

    (A) the actor has been previously convicted under this section; or

    (B) the actor uses a vehicle or watercraft while the actor is in flight and the actor has not been previously convicted under this section;

    (2) a felony of the third degree if:

    (A) the actor uses a vehicle or watercraft while the actor is in flight and the actor has been previously convicted under this section; or

    (B) another suffers serious bodily injury as a direct result of an attempt by the officer or investigator from whom the actor is fleeing to apprehend the actor while the actor is in flight; or

    (3) a felony of the second degree if another suffers death as a direct result of an attempt by the officer or investigator from whom the actor is fleeing to apprehend the actor while the actor is in flight.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Informative Informative x 2
  6. VicVisionBulldog

    VicVisionBulldog VOG Police Chief

    Top Poster Of Month

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2011
    Messages:
    19,158
    Likes Received:
    8,657
    Location:
    Houston
    Type of Motorcycle Currently Riding:
    13' Vision Tour / 08' Vision Street Premium
    A person's brain has to tell the body to pull the gun and fire. This decision on average is a fraction of a second to a full second and a half, not counting actually doing it. It then takes about the same amount of time to stop shooting. So once the officer sees the threat it neutralized a few more shots will most likely be fired as the brain stops the action.

    On average a police officer can fire 4 shots in a second. So in only three seconds of shooting you can expect the total number of rounds fired to be around 12.
     
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2020
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Funny Funny x 1
  7. VicVisionBulldog

    VicVisionBulldog VOG Police Chief

    Top Poster Of Month

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2011
    Messages:
    19,158
    Likes Received:
    8,657
    Location:
    Houston
    Type of Motorcycle Currently Riding:
    13' Vision Tour / 08' Vision Street Premium
    No matter the training we have or get we don't have x-ray vision and can not see internal damage. Nor do we know when the person will finally be out of fight.

    Also you don't know which shot did the needed damage. It could have been the last one.

    You see this recent shooting? Hey training is way above average. The suspect shot several times and tries to get up so he was shot some more.

     
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2020
    • Winner Winner x 1
  8. kaitiff

    kaitiff Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2012
    Messages:
    6,805
    Likes Received:
    2,614
    Location:
    Keams Canyon Az
    Type of Motorcycle Currently Riding:
    14 XC/07 KPT
    The first comment that my wife made when I told her about this incident was 'What? He got shot point blank SEVEN TIMES and hes' NOT dead? Sounds like the officer needs a little more range time." When I then showed her the video she wanted to know why the hell the officer let the man he was trying to detain drag him all the way around the car and the only thing he did was hang onto his t-shirt. That one I didn't have an answer for....
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  9. VicVisionBulldog

    VicVisionBulldog VOG Police Chief

    Top Poster Of Month

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2011
    Messages:
    19,158
    Likes Received:
    8,657
    Location:
    Houston
    Type of Motorcycle Currently Riding:
    13' Vision Tour / 08' Vision Street Premium
  10. snobnd

    snobnd Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2016
    Messages:
    6,506
    Likes Received:
    1,844
    Type of Motorcycle Currently Riding:
    victory magnum
    • Like Like x 3
  11. VicVisionBulldog

    VicVisionBulldog VOG Police Chief

    Top Poster Of Month

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2011
    Messages:
    19,158
    Likes Received:
    8,657
    Location:
    Houston
    Type of Motorcycle Currently Riding:
    13' Vision Tour / 08' Vision Street Premium
  12. snobnd

    snobnd Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2016
    Messages:
    6,506
    Likes Received:
    1,844
    Type of Motorcycle Currently Riding:
    victory magnum
    Perhaps @Flyboy will chime in!
     
  13. Flyboy

    Flyboy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2014
    Messages:
    14,627
    Likes Received:
    5,519
    Type of Motorcycle Currently Riding:
    Victory Boardwalk
    Although my Unit’s TFO’s practiced firing from an aircraft to include snipers, it would always be a last resort and only when a life was in danger. We mainly used stop sticks with the Air Unit maintaining visual contact to relay position. That said, I have had more than a few suspects surrender to the helicopter alone knowing evasion was futile. At night using FLIR, we would herd with the searchlight.

    Remember the helicopter is a complex piece of machinery and thus subject to issues with components and bullets. We were armored with self sealing fuel and oil cells and crew protection, but is minimal and ours were acquired from the military. The A-Star in the footage was most likely not armored at all, to include fuel cell and oil tanks.

    With that, Phoenix had two helicopters brought down by gunfire and now carries automatic weapons to return fire if needed. I have done low flight on suspects to enhance noise levels for staging officers to surround as suspects who pop up like weasels when I withdraw. Also high surveillance just observe and it is easy to get drawn in closer than needed.

    Seen quite a few crashes and a few shooting situations over the years, but our main objective was to assist the guys in the fight...


    Dog not happy, bad guy smell everywhere...


     
    Last edited: Sep 18, 2020
    • Like Like x 1
    • Informative Informative x 1
  14. Flyboy

    Flyboy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2014
    Messages:
    14,627
    Likes Received:
    5,519
    Type of Motorcycle Currently Riding:
    Victory Boardwalk
    A PSA for the mental giants on here and especailly visitors from the Commonwealth to the North:

     
    • Funny Funny x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
  15. satxron

    satxron Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 19, 2009
    Messages:
    10,011
    Likes Received:
    2,095
    Location:
    San Antonio
    Type of Motorcycle Currently Riding:
    2006 Kingpin
    I don't know, he wasn't afraid to wrestle with him or follow him with a taser stuck to him. When he was bent over with his back turned 3' away, step back when you see the knife and shoot him. There is no evidence in that case that he continued to be an aggressor. One thing we know for sure. One of those rounds made it clear he was not getting up. I think it was overkill, no pun intended, but legal. I think Flyboy is right, panic, adrenaline, whatever. Way too many shots with people around.

    That video you posted. She is a good shot, but with all those people downrange. I would have liked him about 15' closer just for a sure hit center mass. 10-12 people exactly in her sight line downstream. That is scary stuff. He needed to get shot. Looked like suicide via cop to me.
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
Similar Threads
  1. VicVisionBulldog
    Replies:
    5,891
    Views:
    152,945
Loading...

Share This Page